CT Shooting

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So what was Flight 93, then? The terrorists with their box cutters were overtaken by passengers who were unarmed.

As long as we are taking stuff that doesn't matter and bringing it into the discussion...

Bigdogjim said:
Actually by box cutter Sept.11, 2001 2,997 people and 4 jets highjacked over American sky's all with a simple box cutter.
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I have a far greater fear of my children being enslaved by a dictatorial government then being killed at school. Why is my fear greater, because based on History that is the more likely threat.

The action and firing speed of an AR-15 is the same as is ~75% of the guns in the USA. The focus on the gun is a distraction to allow another step towards tyranny.

I will never, ever forget awakening in the middle of the night as a child to the dog barking, my mom screaming and father yelling stop or I will shoot. A drug crazed maniac had broken into our house. My father held him with his M1 Carbine until the police arrived.

32,000 people a year are killed in Autos that are required to be built to Gov't safety standards and are operated by people licensed by the Gov't. On average 51 people a year are killed by Lightning.

300,000 Federal Laws of which 4,600 are in the Criminal Code. I think the problem is way too many laws.


I say the Federal Gov't should pass a law requiring all who believe in gun free zones to display a symbol designating same on their person, home, vehicle and place of work. This way the criminals will know where to go and I will know where not to go.

A gun free zone is a shooting gallery for those of EVIL intent.
 
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sailsmen said:
I have a far greater fear of my children being enslaved by a dictatorial government then being killed at school. Why is my fear greater, because based on History that is the more likely threat.

The action and firing speed of an AR-15 is the same as is ~75% of the guns in the USA. The focus on the gun is a distraction to allow another step towards tyranny.

I will never, ever forget awakening in the middle of the night as a child to the dog barking, my mom screaming and father yelling stop or I will shoot. A drug crazed maniac had broken into our house. My father held him with his M1 Carbine until the police arrived.

32,000 people a year are killed in Autos that are required to be built to Gov't safety standards and are operated by people licensed by the Gov't. On average 51 people a year are killed by Lightning.

300,000 Federal Laws of which 4,600 are in the Criminal Code. I think the problem is way too many laws.


I say the Federal Gov't should pass a law requiring all who believe in gun free zones to display a symbol designating same on their person, home, vehicle and place of work. This way the criminals will know where to go and I will know where not to go.

A gun free zone is a shooting gallery.
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Just curious, so gun owners are never victims of crimes?

The thought that owning a gun will prevent you from being the victim of a crime is ludicrous

Evil will happen no matter what, the only way to stop it is to be brave in the face of it, I can do that with or without a gun

I've asked this before, but the pro gun people on this site haven't answered, and I'd like to hear their take

Shouldn't it be more difficult to get a gun than walking into a gun show, flashing my drivers license and walking out with a gun?

No one is trying to take away your guns, because it won't happen

This bill they are talking about is ridiculous, reduce magazines from 18-15 bullets, won't make a difference

Ban AR 15s? Something will replace it

How about a mandatory training program, extensive background search, medical and mental history, and have to requalify every 3 years

Law abiding carriers should care less about this, because they'll pass, if you can't pass then maybe you shouldn't own a gun

Using the car analogy, you have to pass a test to get the license, after school, and retest as you get older

Also the car analogy doesn't hold water, people get into accidents for many reasons, liquor, road conditions, blowouts and stupid.

Last I heard no body slipped on the ice and killed themselves with a gun


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No mention made of anything other than gun control by Mr. Obama today. I guess mental health and violent video games being mentioned by almost everyone eluded him. Seems I was misled, NPR decided not to report the rest of the story. I guess it did not fit their agenda.

School teachers are not police officers. I have serious issues with them being responsible to take down a active shooter especially enlight of their involvement with the possible victims. They would need to respond IMMEDIATELY, not after saving their own class. There is no time for victims with a active shooter loose. A cop in MN learned that the hard way. We had one sole mission. Remove the threat. The horrified faces of education administrators from schools and colleges that attended a tabletop exercise I participated in was very telling. There is a lot more to it than meets the eye. You do not train just once.
 
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duhtroll said:
Or how about I have worked in schools for the last 21 years - since I don't watch any "media" I'm wondering what you're referring to. Nothing I said is in dispute unless you can give valid reasons how a Cadillac could have killed those 20 kids/6 staff members.

I own guns. I shoot guns. I won't carry one at school.

Surveyed the staff over lunch. Only two teachers would volunteer to carry if they were allowed. Both of them are avid Rush listeners. Go figure.
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Ironically, I've been an LEO for 21 years, How can a Cadillac kill 20+ people, drive it up the sidewalk when school is letting out.

Since only Rush listeners are willing to put their lives out there for you, I would take a pass, I'd just line up for the slaughter.

PonyUp had a good suggestion, you can add fields to you license, after going through a battery of mental health tests, shooting courses, safety courses and background tests, then you can buy a firearm, you can add to it as well, to make it a concealed weapons permit as well.

But, you will also have to start taking the law serious and punish those who break it as opposed to the slap on the wrist that most get.
 
Spectragod said:
To answer your question, if an LEO saw the 11YO point a gun @ someone, and if that 11 YO didn't follow commands or they felt another life was in danger, then the correct response is to neutralize the threat.

As far as the gun in the back seat, how can you remove the cartridge and there still be a round in the chamber, if that is what the news said, then that is part of the problem.

I did not present the story accurately. My error.

Seems his father accidentally shot him.

http://search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A0oG.../in_the_news/147865/7yearold_shot_to_death_in
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OK. Question for you. Put your uniform on for this.

I am a civilian. I ask you, "if I am present at a public mass shooting, the police have been called and I have a choice whether to run away, hide or pull my sidearm and start shooting at the perp while innocents are present, what do you suggest I do?"

What is your department's official policy on telling civilians what to do in this case?

Oh, and 20 people killed by a car? How many times has that happened in the US? Intentionally? OR do people choose something much easier and more effective?

Understand I am only after two things here.
1) elimination of the lack of background checks for gun permits/purchases / eliminating the gun show loophole
2) A ban on large magazines

A cogent argument for why any US citizen needs either of those things does not exist.


Spectragod said:
Ironically, I've been an LEO for 21 years, How can a Cadillac kill 20+ people, drive it up the sidewalk when school is letting out.

Since only Rush listeners are willing to put their lives out there for you, I would take a pass, I'd just line up for the slaughter.

PonyUp had a good suggestion, you can add fields to you license, after going through a battery of mental health tests, shooting courses, safety courses and background tests, then you can buy a firearm, you can add to it as well, to make it a concealed weapons permit as well.

But, you will also have to start taking the law serious and punish those who break it as opposed to the slap on the wrist that most get.
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Ive read this thread and tried to remain silent! The bottom line is this not a gun control issue those who do mass destruction with guns either buy them legally before going crazy ,or break into someone's house and steals them!
Reducing magazine capacity is another feel good fix for dummies it won't change a thing, just the need to carry an extra mag or two or three!
As for schools we simply do not live in a society where you can just walk in freely!
Schools need to be locked down with armed gaurds or police officers as this type of terrorist attack will happen again if we don't make changes today!
 
"I am a civilian. I ask you, "if I am present at a public mass shooting, the police have been called and I have a choice whether to run away, hide or pull my sidearm and start shooting at the perp while innocents are present, what do you suggest I do?"


Have you been trained or did you just buy a gun? If you were trained you know the answer. If you are not trained, leave the guns home.

A citizen stopped the mall shooting in Oregon last week, not the police. The active shooter profile says they pick a soft target, expect no resistance and usually commit sucide when confronted. A off duty Deputy shoot a potentential mass murder last night. Unfortunately the police did not arrive in time to save 27 people in Newtown. But their response saved an unknown number more.

There are many answers, gun control is only a component. A ban on AR type rifles? Worthless. Smack a few people while they grow up, priceless.

Forgot, the car killings, they've happened, just not on a large scale, yet. Not sexy enough for the media.
 
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We already know how to stop school shootings.

http://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2012/12/19/we-know-how-to-stop-school-shootings-n1470804


gun-control.jpg


"If guns kills people, mine must be defective." ~ Ted Nugent.
 
Leadfoot281 said:
We already know how to stop school shootings.

http://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2012/12/19/we-know-how-to-stop-school-shootings-n1470804


gun-control.jpg


"If guns kills people, mine must be defective." ~ Ted Nugent.
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Yep, our illustrious governor is calling for a "special session" of our legislature and senate next week. He wants to further tighten the most restrictive gun laws in the country already. Pure politics... and people ask why we are moving to SC. Get a friggin clue.
 
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I put some lights on the back deck this afternoon.

About a block away is a grammar school. Kids were outside (decent weather day in NJ), and I could hear, as corny as it may sound, the laughter of little children.

Got a bit choked up.

Who's going to protect these kids?

Arm the principal/teachers, but what happens when the kids get on the schoolbus?

Arm the drivers?

My retired friend drives a schoolbus. He's just about to hit the age of 71. (I'm almost 70.)

We do not have the reflexes of a 45 year old. That's a fact of old age.

I exercise regularly, lift weights, walk 5 miles or ride an indoor bike for 40 minutes, but, I'm still 70. Nothing I can do about that.

We're old, and we'd still do everything we can to protect innocents, but, the key words here are "everything we can".

I hope it never happens.
 
jerrym3 said:
I put some lights on the back deck this afternoon.

About a block away is a grammar school. Kids were outside (decent weather day in NJ), and I could hear, as corny as it may sound, the laughter of little children.

Got a bit choked up.

Who's going to protect these kids?

Arm the principal/teachers, but what happens when the kids get on the schoolbus?

Arm the drivers?

My retired friend drives a schoolbus. He's just about to hit the age of 71. (I'm almost 70.)

We do not have the reflexes of a 45 year old. That's a fact of old age.

I exercise regularly, lift weights, walk 5 miles or ride an indoor bike for 40 minutes, but, I'm still 70. Nothing I can do about that.

We're old, and we'd still do everything we can to protect innocents, but, the key words here are "everything we can".

I hope it never happens.
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Thats pretty damn good for 70. :up: Hell, I'm fallin apart at 57. :(
 
rayjay said:
A citizen stopped the mall shooting in Oregon last week, not the police. .
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Uh, no, he didn't. HE didn't do anything other than effectively say "yeah, the killer saw me with a gun so he decided to kill himself."

Proximity does not grant causality.

And since Ann Coulter has made it here to be considered an "expert" on something other than which brand of tinfoil to use for the hats...

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/armed-civilians-do-not-stop-mass-shootings

I don't agree with everything in the above article, but it raises some good points.
 
Columbine had an armed security guard with another nearby. That is the worst school shooting on record. For how long, is the question.

Reducing magazine capacity makes the shooter reload more often and therefore reduces innocent deaths. Because...math.

There is nothing for "dummies" about not wanting 30+ round magazines available for non-military personnel. It is simple logic.

MOTOWN MARAUDER said:
Ive read this thread and tried to remain silent! The bottom line is this not a gun control issue those who do mass destruction with guns either buy them legally before going crazy ,or break into someone's house and steals them!
Reducing magazine capacity is another feel good fix for dummies it won't change a thing, just the need to carry an extra mag or two or three!
As for schools we simply do not live in a society where you can just walk in freely!
Schools need to be locked down with armed gaurds or police officers as this type of terrorist attack will happen again if we don't make changes today!
Click to expand...
 
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