Education

duhtroll

duhtroll

If it weren't for my horse...
Yep - I started an off-topic thread, which I rarely ever do. Just been sitting on this one a while and wanted to share.

A "new" perspective: (not new to educators but maybe to you)

In 2011, it is projected that the world's information base will be doubling about every 11 hours. (IBM)

I see posts about "our schools suck because kids today just don't learn the way we did and know the stuff we know."

Of course they don't. They couldn't if they tried. Their brains work differently.

They are responsible not for information, but for application. Your education was designed around delivering information (facts). Theirs isn't. The kids of today have all the information they could ever need in their phone. On what do you test a kid who has Google in their pocket?

Remembering data is just not necessary like it was in the past. They need to be able to find it and know what to do with it.

"Their handwriting and spelling suck and they can't even find X on a map!"

Cursive is no longer being taught. Instead, they learn keyboarding from kindergarten (or earlier). We learned to write because we needed to know how in order to do work. Kids today don't need handwriting very often. Spelling is a pet peeve of mine, too, but the definition of literacy is evolving and we need to evolve with it or be left behind.

It is also projected that teachers and schools today are preparing kids to compete against global, not regional competition for careers that don't even EXIST yet. How? We aren't really sure. How could we be?

Job applications and interviews revolve less around knowledge and more around adaptability and skill in collaboration. How can you learn to service a machine that won't exist for 5 years?

"Schools cost too damn much - I am tired of them always asking for money!"

Schools need computers now. Those cost more than books. Books are often outdated by the time they are finished printing. If you want kids to stay current, they need to have current tech in their hands.

Just some thoughts for you folks out there. Schools are radically different than they were just 5 years ago. And in 5 more years we won't recognize what they were today.

And if your schools are NOT different, time to move!
 
Schoold should teach things such as:
-How to manage your fininces
-How to make your marriage last
-Common Sense.

Pointless facts on history, biology etc are just that...pointless.
 
Interesting perspective.

My daughter is in the 5th grade at a Catholic school, and is still being taught cursive.

Computers are there for the students, and Caitlin has had computer class since the 2nd grade. Along with Spanish class.

I never would have thought that a 5th grade education in a Catholic school would cost close to $5,000.00 annually.

Catholic high schools are now just over $10,000.00.

Children today cannot spell as they are too accustomed to texting on their phones.

That too, is a peeve of mine. Spelling correctly.

Mike.
 
teachers Yea!

Good stuff.
I did something I rarely do too.
I spelled everything correctly and rated this thread :bows:
 
Zack said:
Schoold should teach things such as:
-How to manage your fininces
-How to make your marriage last
-Common Sense.

Pointless facts on history, biology etc are just that...pointless.
Click to expand...

I totally agree with you! The only thing I would say is that our American History is important to know. Just to know where we came from and keep our Heritage in tact. We can learn alot from the mistakes that were made in the past.:beer:
 
Since my exit from the, USMC, I have attended in the area of 20-25 schools, mostly for Technical knowledge, some just for fun. Usually I'm in with others much younger than I, and always thought they were just dunces, but your enlightening post has changed the way I see it now. BTW my daughter, 30ish, is always called upon anytime I need to do anything on my computer.
 
In order to communicate effectively the basic foundations of speech, reading and writing must be mastered. In order to process data math must be mastered. This should be done by the 8th grade.

Beyond 8th grade critical thinking skills is what education needs to focus on and develop.

You are right children are taught different today. When I have helped my children with their home work they have to explain the question/problem to me because it makes no sense to me. I know the answer so I can tell them if they are right or wrong but I cannot explain the answer including math answers in a way that they will get credit for. I can only tell them if their answer is right or wrong.

I recently read a report that if the electricity is out for a year in the USA 90% will die. If what you say is correct then in 10 years 99% would die. With critical thinking skills you can solve new problems with old data.
 
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Young, still partying, not wanting to grow up parents who thought it would be a good idea to make babies are the reason kids are the way they are.

The world would be a better place if no one had children for the next 10 years.
 
As a current college student, I couldn't agree more. I guess I'm just old enough to have been taught some of the things you've said are missing, but I am not surprised that they aren't around any more, I see it every day in classes where my peers cannot read properly, even simple words.

To ANY of my friends, I will always say that the knowledge and ability to communicate will always be the first and foremost important skill set to have, because without it all your trivia is useless. On a more specific case in the same vein, working as an IT tech I find it insulting and disgusting when someone can't even tell me the problem they are having with their computer. It's ok to not have a technical knowledge of why your computer isn't working, but just telling me "it's broke", and then responding "I dunno" when I ask you what is happening that is out of the ordinary, unacceptable.


Personally, I think the education system gets worse and worse as you progress up the ladder. Professors aren't held accountable for anything (SERIOUS problem), and more and more that are getting hired are young to the point of they just left school for their doctorate degree themselves. When I have more workplace experience than you, and you are 5-8 years older than me, I have a problem with you telling me "that's just how it is in the 'real world'".


But just to kind of second your point and add on, I really think the direction we are going right now is a highly-specialized population, instead of "well-rounded", for better or worse.
 
What more do you want professors to do?
You get snot-nosed kids coming through the doors, worse and worse every year.

If you so much as look at the kid wrong the parents have a lawsuit against the school.

The biggest problem is this: So many parents just dont give a crap, that the product of their raising turns out to be nothing but mis-guided then the school system gets blamed.
Then you have a the few kids who are raised properly, by parents that are smart, caring and know whats best......and then the good kid doesnt fit in with the general population and starts acting like all the other F ups.

I can still honestly say Im never having kids and for all the reasons listed above.

(and besides, im WAAAYYYY to selfish to be buying diapers when I can be buying go-fast parts)
 
Zack said:
What more do you want professors to do?
You get snot-nosed kids coming through the doors, worse and worse every year.
Click to expand...

A friend of mine had a professor who, to his face, told him that the professor overseeing the collider at Stanford and the man that was part of a team that designed airbus were unacceptable references for one of his mechanics(scientific sense) papers, saying that they "don't know what they are talking about". This professor is like 28.

I had a professor just last semester that decided she should take it upon herself to design a syllabus for a class called "American Poetry and Drama" around only the Harlem Renaissance, with one extra mention of the gay movement in Harlem around the same time period. TL;DR: instead of teaching about the class as was titled and summarized in the course catalog, she decided to just talk about what SHE wanted to talk about. This same professor also told me that the way I was writing papers, which I had been receiving A-grades on for years and was also taught in this same university, was wrong and that my previous instructors were wrong in teaching it to me.

These were some of the worse ones, but this kind of stuff happens a LOT on MANY campuses. I think the college education system in general is just extremely flawed, but that's not particularly relevant here.

I will say though, that at least recently, I've had a handful of professors that have gone that extra mile and who's intentions you could clearly see were to have students learn instead of rambling on about something for hours and then acting upset or annoyed when someone doesn't understand and wants help.
 
sailsmen said:
In order to communicate effectively the basic foundations of speech, reading and writing must be mastered. In order to process data math must be mastered. This should be done by the 8th grade.

Beyond 8th grade critical thinking skills is what education needs to focus on and develop.

You are right children are taught different today. When I have helped my children with their home work they have to explain the question/problem to me because it makes no sense to me. I know the answer so I can tell them if they are right or wrong but I cannot explain the answer including math answers in a way that they will get credit for. I can only tell them if their answer is right or wrong.

I recently read a report that if the electricity is out for a year in the USA 90% will die. If what you say is correct then in 10 years 99% would die. With critical thinking skills you can solve new problems with old data.
Click to expand...


^^^^^^^ Big +1 ^^^^^^ Effective communication transcends writing in cursive or text processing, or texting on your cell phone, and if you can't think critically and can't communicate your thoughts coherently, you're screwed. IMO, that's a constant from my generation to the current day.
 
Great post and interesting thoughts. I will say what I see more and more today from the youth is a sense of entitlement.

"I have a college degree and deserve to make X"
"I went to college and you can't tell me what to do"

Education is more than learning about facts or reading about history or working math problems. A good portion of education comes from practical real world experience. I truly wish that all kids would work a job of at least 25 hrs a week while still attending high school. Perhaps this would eliminate the sense of entitlement that many of them have.

In my experience, many kids coming out of college nowadays just think they are better than those around them, especially people who didn't go to college but have been working hard in their jobs full time since they were 18.

Agreed, there needs to be a greater focus on critical thinking and problem solving as they advance through the education years.

But the biggest problem I see, and this has alwaays been a problem, is disrespect. Maybe I just notice it more now that I am older, but it seems like there is no respect for those that have trailblazed the path ahead of them. (This is not applicable to all, but a good portion of todays youth.)

Just my thoughts, where is that soap box?
 
The critical thinking part - that is what I am getting at. A simple "fill in the blank" worksheet is worthless to a kid today. They can look up every answer and forget it before the class is over.

In contrast, asking them questions that require application of the knowledge, like "explain the controversy (both sides) surrounding the proposed placement of an Islamic cultural center in New York" requires both knowledge and thought.
 
duhtroll said:
The critical thinking part - that is what I am getting at. A simple "fill in the blank" worksheet is worthless to a kid today. They can look up every answer and forget it before the class is over.

In contrast, asking them questions that require application of the knowledge, like "explain the controversy (both sides) surrounding the proposed placement of an Islamic cultural center in New York" requires both knowledge and thought.
Click to expand...

ABSOLUTELY! Unfortunately, IMO, the former is often the case; i.e. looking up the answer, but making no effort to apply the knowledge once learned.
 
Alright, as a current sophmore in college.... i have to say this. ..


Zack is right. I never really became eccentric until I thought I needed to to fit in with the "In" crowd. If I didnt, id have ALOT of trouble at school. Im not a genuine ******* and am a really nice guy. I was raised to be respectful and intellegent as a kid, unfortunately 4 years of highschool ruined that for me.
 
duhtroll said:
The critical thinking part - that is what I am getting at. A simple "fill in the blank" worksheet is worthless to a kid today. They can look up every answer and forget it before the class is over.

In contrast, asking them questions that require application of the knowledge, like "explain the controversy (both sides) surrounding the proposed placement of an Islamic cultural center in New York" requires both knowledge and thought.
Click to expand...

People think that the people on jeopardy are smart... They merely have a good memory and can regurgitate facts. Most of them couldn't change their own cars oil for example.
 
The only two things you need to know, by CBT:
1.) Learn how to manage your money.
2.) Learn what emotional intelligence is and how to use it.
 
Zack said:
Schoold should teach things such as:
-How to manage your fininces
-How to make your marriage last
-Common Sense.

Pointless facts on history, biology etc are just that...pointless.
Click to expand...

Schools should also concentrate more on spelling... ;)
 
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